Chief Red Cloud: The Only American Indian in History to Defeat the U.S. Army in a War

00:00:12
Speaker 1: This is our American stories. The great Sioux Warrior Statesmen. Red Cloud was the only American Indian in history to defeat the United States Army in a war, forcing the government to sue for peace on his terms. Bob Drury and Tom Claven have finally given the little known Red Cloud the recognition he deserves with their New York Times bestseller The Heart of Everything. That is the untold story of Red Cloud, an American legend. Here’s Bob and Tom to share the story with us. Beginning with Bob.

00:00:48
Speaker 2: This book, it’s basically an untold story until now about how one man created an empire, if you will, on the high Plains. At one point, Red Cloud’s territory included about one fifth of what is today the contiguous United States, and no one before, we don’t think, really knew what was going on in that great swath of territory bounded by the Missouri Rivers, the Mississippi River, and the Rockies and cartographers, early cartographers, despite Lewis and Clark’s exploration, they just labeled it the Great American Desert. And no one knew how Red Cloud had consolidated this empire. Now, of course, when he fought his war and won his war against the United States, the only American Indians ever win a war, not a battle, a war against the United States. People certainly knew who he was, but we were a little trepidacious when we first started this book. Obviously there was no one left from the nineteenth century. But what we did find is that our forebears were such literate peace people. We went into this expecting maybe we’d get some after action reports from the army when the soldiers started moving west, maybe the officers, maybe an officer’s wife might have kept a journal. As it turns out, every teamster’s wife kept a diary. And we found all these and letters and Tom, he’ll explain to you. At some of these university libraries and historical centers they would bring out a journal in a plexic lass case and you had to turn the pages with tongs because your oil from your fingers would destroy the vellum. I guess it was written on. And there were letters from twelve year old girls who had passed the Oregon train. You know, Paul was killed last year by the Indians first train in this year. Said they dug up his grave. Maybe it was wolves, but we think it might have been Indians again, that kind of stuff. So we actually felt like we were interviewing people for this book. As far fetched as that might sound, we got into it so much that we felt we were living the lives with these people that said, I’m going to have to give you a little what we call the dreaded backstory, because you really can’t understand Red Cloud without understanding the Sioux Nation. So what we do know what was to become the pre Columbian Sioux Nation. It was seven tribes, the tribes of the Seven Council Fires. They followed the Mississippi Valley north and they settled in Minnesota. Now in Minnesota, they were the baddest Indians in the Great Lake region and for centuries they just made unending war on their predominantly Algonquin neighbors, the Creed, the Chippewa, and they were vicious. They war was their ethos. Unlike other tribes. They had no non violent culture. They did not make pots, they did not grow food, they did not even paint anything on their tepees or their shields. War was the reason for being. And the first Europeans, mostly French, who looked at the Sioux, I mean they were imediately reminded of the Norse berserkers, or the Huns or the Mongols.

00:04:05
Speaker 3: The Sioux lived to make war. That was their ethos, and they were good at it, and they were real good at it in for centuries, for hundreds of years, they just dominated the region. But then what.

00:04:15
Speaker 2: Happened was when the English trading ships started to come into Hudson Bay, and the Cree and the Chippewahu lived closer to the bay began trading pelts for guns, and the tables turned. Once the Sioux had been the hunter, now they were the hunted. Once they had extolled violence for a violence. Say, see what the Europeans didn’t understand watching in particular the Sioux, but the American Indian culture in general.

00:04:41
Speaker 3: Was it wasn’t violence for violence sake.

00:04:43
Speaker 2: Yes, they fought wars to gain territory and to bring home booty. But also the old cliche the happy hunting ground. The Sioux and most of the plane stripes for that matter, really believed that there was an afterlife that was a happy hunting ground, and it was filled with clear running streams and game as far as you can see, a buffalo and elk and deer, an antelope, and beautiful maidens just waiting to be taken. But what happened was there They believed that you went to this afterlife in the.

00:05:15
Speaker 3: Same way you left the earth.

00:05:18
Speaker 2: So what the Europeans didn’t understand about the scalpings and about the mutilations. And if you went to the if your enemy went to the happy honey ground with no eyes to see how beautiful it was, if he went with no arms to draw back a bowstring, if he went with no penis to take advantage of these comely maidens, well then you had he had suffered two indignities at your hands, one here on Earth and one there. And that’s what a lot of this was all about. When the Europeans came down, of course, they didn’t understand this at all, and they started trading guns with the other Indians, and the other Indians began hunting the Sioux, who were still using prehistoric tools flintlock knives, flintlock arrowheads. They drove the Sioux and the swamps of Minnesota, and finally their territory just became so compromised that they had a choice, an existential choice. They either would die or they had to step out onto the prairie. They ended up stepping out onto the prairie. Even on the prairie, they were still even though they kept up their warlike ethos, but they were still the tribes we don’t think of the Mandans, Arik Karraz, the Rees, the Omahas, the OTO’s. They were kicking the siouxs. But because these tribes were mounted and the Sioux were not yet mounted. And one Cheyenne, one regal Cheyenne I, described the Sioux as scraggly, lce ridden band begging for handouts.

00:06:41
Speaker 3: That’s how bad it was. But that all changed again.

00:06:44
Speaker 2: The worm turned yet again when the English started coming down first the Minnesota River and then the Missouri River and establishing trade fairs.

00:06:53
Speaker 3: Now they were on the edge of.

00:06:55
Speaker 2: Sioux the Northman Sioux territory, and the Sioux were the ones the first tribes to get weapons, to get guns, to get shot, to get ammunition, to get iron pots that.

00:07:06
Speaker 3: They would break into arrowheads. Sooner or later, the Sioux took.

00:07:10
Speaker 2: Their revenge on the smaller tribes that had been almost picking them apart, the Mandans, Zoto’s, the Rees. And then something happened that changed the course of Western history the Spanish.

00:07:28
Speaker 3: I love this part of the book, and I love this story.

00:07:29
Speaker 2: But I won’t go too off course here, but I will say when the Spanish brought the tough little mustang into South America and Mexico, it was a match made in heaven. Unlike the big, lumbering Northern European war horses or plow horses, these mustangs had started out on the Central Asian steps and had followed the trade routes through the Mid East along northern Africa, had interbred with desert horses. And when the more invaded Spain, they came over with these tough little months and they were right at home on the Andalusian plane. They could run forever, they could eat weed, they could eat bark, and once again, when the Spanish brought them to the New World, they were right at home in the New World. What happened was is the Spanish, as they conquered and forcibly converted the Indians up into what is now the United States, they made deals with them. You worship our God, who you don’t understand. We’re basically going to enslave you. You grow our crops, but in exchange we have horses and we’re going to We’re going to protect you from your age old enemy, the Apache. Well, the Apache began raiding haci anders and rancheros, and they got horses. They didn’t know how if an Apatche would ride a horse will have died, any would eat it, so they didn’t know how to breathe it.

00:08:48
Speaker 3: But this gave them room to.

00:08:52
Speaker 2: Further out their raids, and they started raiding the pueblo.

00:08:55
Speaker 3: And the pueblo said, anyway, you enslaved us.

00:08:58
Speaker 2: You’re making us worship some Christian god we know nothing about, and you’re into the dealers to protect us from the Apache.

00:09:03
Speaker 3: You can’t even do that now.

00:09:05
Speaker 2: So in sixteen eighty the pueblo rose and they drove the Spanish back into Old Mexico. And the Spanish ran so fast they left everything behind. So the pueblo they ate the cattle, they ate the sheep, but they weren’t a horse try, and they just let the horses go. And this was the beginning of the great horse expansion of the United the northern hemisphere of the United States.

00:09:27
Speaker 1: And you’re listening to Bob Drury and you’ll be hearing the story, the continuing story of Red Cloud, the New York Times bestseller The Heart of Everything, That is the untold story of Red Cloud, an American legend. The story continues here on our American stories, and we continue with our American stories and with Bob Drury and Tom claven and they’re telling the untold story of Red Cloud. Let’s continue with Bob.

00:10:20
Speaker 2: And so the horse gradually made its way along once again ancient trade routes north. The Comanche were the first true true horsemen on the plains. They were a scraggly tribe too, that had come out of the Wind River Range in Wyoming. But they learned how to breed horses. They made rudimentary saddles. They were Sam Winds Empire of the Summer Moon, which is a tremendous book.

00:10:42
Speaker 3: Tom and I.

00:10:43
Speaker 2: Argue with Sam about who were better horsemen to commands here the Sioux. I think, if you go by territory long you have to have I think you have to go with the Sioux. At least that’s what we tell Sam. But the horses made their way north of Kiowa and Kansas what is today Kansas got them the Poonee Nebraska all the way up to the Cree in Canada, and of course, the Cheyenne.

00:11:02
Speaker 3: The Sioux, the Crow, the old acquired horses.

00:11:04
Speaker 2: The Sioux just took to the horse naturally, and much like the early Apache rates, now they could spread out more. They conquered what remnants of the smaller tribes, the Yoto’s, the Rees, the Mandans, and then they took on the big boys, and they pushed the Pawnee out. They pushed the Kiowa out of the Black Hills. They pushed the Crow out of the Powder River country and up into the Rockies. They controlled basically parts of months from Minnesota to Montana, to the Great Salt Lake and down to.

00:11:39
Speaker 3: Lower Colorado. Even it was just it was an.

00:11:42
Speaker 2: Empire, but the Sioux were still seven nations, seven tribes. Sitting Bull, I’m sure you’ve all heard of he was a hunk. Papa Crazy Horse was an Oglala. Red Cloud himself had an Oglala mother and a brutal father. So these seven tribes were further scattered into the fractious bands and clans. They all spoke the same language and they all had the same culture, but they were not united, and they wouldn’t fight each other. But they weren’t enemies, but they weren’t friendly towards each other. They were just waiting for someone, if someone would come along and unite them. So in eighteen twenty one, on the banks of Bluewater Creek and what is now the Stubby Little Panhandle of Nebraska, two nights before, a meteor had shot through the sky left a giant, a red swathe of cloud across the sky. And in eighteen twenty one, by the banks of Bluewater Creek, a baby was born and his father named him Red Cloud. And Red Cloud was the man who would eventually unite these people. Tom will tell you about that.

00:12:50
Speaker 4: As Bob just said, Red Cloud was born in May of eighteen twenty one.

00:12:55
Speaker 5: And there’s so many.

00:12:57
Speaker 4: Stories that we’ve heard of in history of peace people men and women who had to have very difficult childhoods and had to rise above them. And the resiliency and the strength that they gained from their experiences made them into leaders, made them tougher than some of their rivals. And that was certainly Red Cloud’s situation. He was born in eighteen twenty one. His mother was called Walks as she thinks. He had a younger brother, little Spider. Eventually, when Red Cloud was only five years old, his father died. And his father didn’t die of a war or an accident or anything like. He died of alcoholism. So we’re talking about the mid eighteen twenties and here’s a Sioux man dying of alcohololism. And when the traders, some of the explorers, but the traders, some of the early migrants, the people who are working their way west. There were three powerful diseases they brought with them smallpox, cholera, and alcohol. And the Indians did not have any immunity to any of these diseases. They were felled by the hundreds. And Red Cloud thus had to grow up without a father. A advantage he had is that his mother went back to her Oglala band that was run by the headman.

00:14:14
Speaker 5: There was a man named Old Smoke.

00:14:16
Speaker 3: Who she called brother.

00:14:18
Speaker 4: Now we don’t know were they biologically brothers or was that just a relationship that they had or brother and sister relationship, But in any case, Old Smoke took in this woman and her two young, fatherless children. Red Cloud was not given anything, you know, he didn’t have a father who was going to bring him up the ladder, so to speak, like Crazy Horse had, like Sitting Bull would have so he had to earn everything. He had to become the best rider, he had to become the best hunter. Eventually had to become the best warrior. And over time, even when he was a teenager. You know, there’s a section in the book where we talk about he went into his first battle when he was sixteen years old, and there was great excitement in the village. This war party was being put together because for the first time, Red Cloud was putting on the war paint and getting ready for battle. And you know, the people in the village were saying, red Cloud comes, Red Cloud comes. As he made his way on his horse to join this war party. So at a very early age, he showed qualities and talents that were superior to most of the people in his tribe. In the eighteen thirties eighteen forties, he became he rose up the ranks, he became a leader, he became a great warrior, and being a warrior, was a great warrior was very important because we’ve sort of likened it to what was going on in the Great Plains at the time.

00:15:37
Speaker 5: It was sort of like gang warfare.

00:15:39
Speaker 4: You know, the tribes, the Siue, the Arapaho, the Cheyenne, the Pawnee, the Crow.

00:15:45
Speaker 5: They were almost.

00:15:46
Speaker 4: Always at war with each other. And it wasn’t just a war like, Okay, we want to defeat you and conquer you. It was well, we want this hunting ground. Okay, we know it belongs to you, but not for long. Look out here we come. And so there was constant fighting to steal horses, to steal lands. Obviously, if you had the best hunting ground, your tribe had a better chance of survival because they were going to be more buffalo, they were going to be more elk, they’re going to be more antelope. And one of the things that Red Cloud he displayed not only great courage and great strength, he demonstrated great intelligence and empathy. When he came back from a successful hunting raid, for example, he didn’t just keep everything for himself. He made sure that the elders got some of what he brought back. He made sure that some families that was struggling to take care of themselves got some of his bounty that he brought back.

00:16:44
Speaker 5: He made sure the people who were.

00:16:46
Speaker 4: In power and the tribe, Old Smoke and the other elders that they were taken care of. And in this way he also started to gain a kind of respect that he might otherwise have gotten being a fatherless person. So into the eighteen fifties he began to be viewed by the Oglalas as not chief. And I think that’s important one of the more interesting things that we found out there was no chief. You know, we’re used to somebody who is an authority in Native American circles being a chief, but that was actually a white man invention. Red Cloud was not a chief, but he became like the most powerful warrior and the head of their warrior society, and he was observing what was going on. Even though the tribes spent most of their time fighting each other, they couldn’t help noticing that there were more and more white people showing up. Fort Laramie was probably the most prominent fort in that part on Missouri and west of the Missouri, and it would be a way station as people coming from the east would stop and force Fort Laramie. They would pick up more people, drop off some people, get supplies, drop off supplies, change horses or whatever, and then they would go on. That’s what the Oregon Trail was about. They would be going on to Oregon, or they would be going up to other places. Certainly, when gold was discovered in California, the immigration accelerated across to the west, going through and the Red Cloud could see that the increase in population of people coming across the territory was doing several things.

00:18:24
Speaker 1: And you’re listening to Bob Drwy and Tom Claven telling the story of Red Cloud and that mention of white people, the original white guys poking around in this neck of the woods after the Louisiana purchase was of course, Lewis and Clark, and we tell their story well. Clay Jenkinson tells their story in our multi part series approaching forty parts, the most epic road Trip ever, the Story of Lewis and Clark, And go to Ouramerican Stories dot com and plug it in download it if you’re taking a long family trip. Nobody tells the story of Lewis and Clark better than Clay and Klay Jenkinson is on the History Channel. You see him all the time, as do you see Bob and Tom.

00:19:07
Speaker 6: And when we come back.

00:19:09
Speaker 1: More of this remarkable story from their New York Times bestseller The Heart of Everything That is The Untold Story of Red Cloud, an American legend continues here on our American stories. And we continue with our American stories and Bob Drury and Tom m claven telling the story of Red Cloud, an American legend.

00:19:47
Speaker 6: Let’s return to the story.

00:19:49
Speaker 4: Red Cloud could see that the increase in population of people coming across the territory was doing several things. One was they were taking a big share of the Buffalo. He also, Red Cloud anticipated that they were going to want to go through and perhaps even occupy the Black Hills. And for those who wonder and don’t know the title of our book, the heart of everything that is. The sue name for the Black Hills was Pahasappa, and to them, translated is the heart of everything that is. The Black Hills was the heart of their existence. That’s where they believe their ancestors came from. And it was sacred land to them, and it certainly could not be given away. It could not certainly just simply be occupied. It could not be taken advantage of by the white explorers and settlers and the army. Certainly. But he saw that coming. He saw this clash. You know, Bob mentioned the word empire before you know, there was this growing empire of the East and there was this empire that Red Cloud was basically had become the head of because he was this intelligent, charismatic man. Indians and even of the tribes respected him. Some feared him, but they respected him, and he could see that they were going to clash against each other. Something interrupted what he saw, and that was the Civil War. When the Civil War broke out in eighteen sixty one, obviously you couldn’t have the kind of forts and army presence in the West that you had because as many everybody was needed back east, and it was kind of a respite there, and it lasted eighteen sixty one to eighteen sixty five. And when the Civil War ended, suddenly there was a big change because this sense of manifest destiny could go right back into full swing, and the enormous increase of people started making their way west again, and the whole coveting of the Great Plains and the Black Hills began all over again.

00:21:48
Speaker 5: So I’ll turn it back over to Bob.

00:21:51
Speaker 2: And during the Civil War two, gold was being discovered all over the West Montana, Idaho, the Front Range in Colorado, and so the miners startarted pouring in. In Red Cloud’s lifetime, I think there were four treaties that were broken.

00:22:04
Speaker 3: The Whites just kept.

00:22:05
Speaker 2: Coming say, okay, we’re going to stop here, we’ll sign a treaty, we’ll touch the pen. Gold would be discovered somewhere and said, oh, well, now that treaty didn’t count, here’s the new one. And Red Cloud was like, he didn’t trust the Whites as far as.

00:22:16
Speaker 3: He could throw them. But with all this goal being discovered all.

00:22:19
Speaker 2: Over the West, he knew it was inevitable that he was going to have to fight them. So he started attacking the miners, and he started attacking the wagon trains on the Oregon Trail, on the in cooperation with During this hiatus that Tom talked about, he had become such a great name in the planes that even though he was a Noglala, warriors from other Sioux bands wanted to ride with him. Hunk Papas would ride in with him and say, we want to ride with you, hunt with you, fight with you. Rules would come in, sans arcs would come in, and so he had developed kind of this inter tribal facility that now he was going to use and turn it on the Whites. He had done that no Indian had ever done before. He had also co opted other tribes, the Cheyenne, the.

00:23:07
Speaker 3: Rapaho, some Shoshone.

00:23:10
Speaker 2: These tribes would fight with the Sioux. This had never happened before. Washington, the officials back east, and the War Department, they had never They had fought seven Holes in Florida, they had fought Mohawks, they had fought Jerokee, but they had never fought multiple tribes at once. And so Red Cloud’s war was a gorilla war. And he would attack and pick off a wagon train here, a supply train there, a male train here. So the miners, of course, and the settlers who were passing through appealed to Washington, who started to.

00:23:41
Speaker 3: Send soldiers west. Civil war was over.

00:23:43
Speaker 2: We’re going to send our soldiers, our battle hardened soldiers to pick off these with these savages. And Red Cloud was winning these skirmishes, and the more soldiers that came out, the more Indians were attracted to his warrior.

00:23:58
Speaker 3: Fiefdom, so to speak.

00:24:00
Speaker 2: Red Cloud would set up three different attacks on a fort here, on a supply train two hundred miles away, and then on a wagon train three hundred.

00:24:08
Speaker 3: Miles away from that. This has never happened before.

00:24:11
Speaker 2: And he would attack, and instead of celebrating, as was the American Indian custom and have it, he would attack the next day and the day after that, and then his warriors would just disappear into the planes. It was true guerrilla warfare, and we didn’t know how to handle it. So we sent out more and more soldiers. They had seen some heart, some heart fighting in the Civil War, but they weren’t used to coming across a supply train where everyone’s penis had been hacked off. Eyeballs gouged out, brains gouged out. We think we found Actually I should credit Tom with this. Tom found a journal and what might be the first time US soldiers making a pact to kill each other rather than be captured by the Indians. I mean, this is how far in this kind of warfare was to them. So finally General Grant and General Sherman said enough is enough to send out an army to.

00:25:01
Speaker 3: Fight Red Cloud.

00:25:02
Speaker 2: Well, Red Cloud wasn’t going to fight their army on the European terms or on the Civil War terms that they wanted, so they sent out thousands of mounted infantry. From the movies, we all think it’s cavalry. John Wayne’s cavalry and it was all mounted infantry who these guys were current of learning how to ride on the fly, and that was another advantage the Sioux had. So in the summer of eighteen sixty five alone, three thousand soldiers combed combed the west looking for Red Cloud, and he would attack them and they could never find him. And then in eighteen sixty six, it’s hard charging Captain Captain Federman Sherman’s hand picked man, go find me Red Cloud, kill him, and kill every Sioux male over the age of twelve. Well, Fetterman gets out there and he’s of the opinion, you know, these are Indians, these are savages. Pre store I could ride through the entire Sioux nation with eighty men, and he tried to do that. He took out eighty one men one day and read Cloud laid a trap for him, and Fetterman rode right into it, and everyone Fetterman included in his command were killed. Now the Americans called it a massacre. The suit called it a fight.

00:26:11
Speaker 3: It was a fair fight. We beat these guys, we killed them.

00:26:14
Speaker 2: But that was the beginning of what came to be known as Red Cloud’s War.

00:26:19
Speaker 3: Now Red Cloud’s War would go on for another two years, and there were.

00:26:22
Speaker 2: Many many more fettermans sent out to capture Red Cloud, and there were many many more American soldiers who were killed while Red Cloud still remained uncaptured and undead.

00:26:33
Speaker 3: So finally, after two years, we needed the gold. I mean, we were living.

00:26:38
Speaker 2: The United States had built up such a national debt during the Civil War. We said, we’ll do any Red Cloud come in, what do you want. We’ll have another treaty. We promised we’ll keep this treaty. We know we’ve broken a dozen before. We promised we’ll keep this one. Just tell us what you want. And Red Cloud had one demand, and it was a pretty big demand. Gave it to Washington representatives and they were like, huh, and so would Washington meet Red Cloud’s demand or would they not.

00:27:07
Speaker 3: This was the key to Red Clouds War.

00:27:10
Speaker 4: The treaty that Red Clouds signed in eighteen sixty eight to end the war was still in effect when gold was discovered in the Black Hills. Miners were prospectors were flooded trying to flood into the Black Hills. For a while, the US government made some attempt to keep them out, but they realized, you know, we’re not going to be able to do that. So they appointed got an expedition together that was headed by George Armstrong Custer, who went in there. And there was no battle. There was no resistance, no opposition put up to Custer going in there. But what was happening is his invasion, so to speak, at the Black Hills, did Bill momentum under the leadership of Sitting Bull and Crazy Horse that they have to stop this, they.

00:27:57
Speaker 3: Have to protect the Black Hills.

00:27:59
Speaker 4: Two years later, the result was Little Big Horn and the depths of Custer and his command at the hands of Sitting Bull and Crazy Horse, which was a battle that Red Cloud did not participate in.

00:28:11
Speaker 3: Red Cloud had already been to Washington.

00:28:13
Speaker 2: Yeah, and he had seen the very first place they took him when he got to this town was to the Navy yard and showed him to cannons.

00:28:21
Speaker 3: So when the white.

00:28:23
Speaker 2: Started pouring into the Black Hills, Sitting Bowl and Crazy Hoarse said, okay, it’s time to fight him again.

00:28:29
Speaker 3: And Red Cloud had kind of honed Crazy Horse.

00:28:32
Speaker 2: He had picked him out as a teenager and made him his field commander at the age of twenty two or something.

00:28:37
Speaker 3: So Crazy Horse and Sitting Bull came back to Redclott said, we got to do it again.

00:28:40
Speaker 2: They’re coming again. They’ve broken another treaty. By this time, Redcott had been to Washington twice, I believe, into New York. He knew what was on the other side of the Mississippi River. And he said to Sitting Bowl and Crazy Horse, he said, no, we can’t beat these people. I’m not going to waste my people. I’m not going to sacrifice my people’s lives. We can’t beat these people, which is why Red Cloud never got involved.

00:29:00
Speaker 5: In the Custom Fighter.

00:29:02
Speaker 1: And great job as always to Greg Hangler for finding this story and editing it and getting it to us, and a special thanks to Bob Drury and to Tom claven And my goodness, what a read, What a book, what a story, the heart of everything that is the untold story of Red Cloud, an American legend.

00:29:20
Speaker 6: Go to Amazon or the usual suspects by the book. You won’t put it down.

00:29:24
Speaker 1: After signing the Treaty of Fort Laramie in eighteen sixty eight, red Cloud led his people in the transition to reservation life.

00:29:32
Speaker 6: In eighteen eighty four.

00:29:33
Speaker 1: He and his family, along with five Indian leaders, converted and were baptized as Catholics by Father Joseph Bushman. Outliving all other major Lakota leaders of the Indian Wars, Red Cloud died on Pine Ridge Reservation in South Dakota in nineteen oh nine at the age of eighty seven, and was buried there in the cemetery now bearing his name. And by the way Red Cloud saw the collision of cultures, there was nothing he could do about it. The original tragedy of this country, the story that we tell, because we tell all the stories good and bad about this great not perfect country, but great country.

00:30:08
Speaker 6: Here on our American stories”